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PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

We're looking into AP classes for the next two years. Any advice out there??

I've already heard the AP Bio horror stories. Even Guidance and Curriculum people acknowledge issues with it.

How about Chem, Physics, World History and Calculus??

I heard just yesterday that last year (2008) out of a full class of AP Chem kids only one (you read that right: ONE) student showed up to take the test. The student did well, but come on...I thought that taking the test was a basic expectation of the class?!?!

Peter Bealo

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TRHSparent · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 147

What do you hope your student to gain by taking an AP class? Is it to test out of required college courses? If so, you need to investigate your preferred college requirements since not all colleges accept AP test scores. A college my student visited discouraged AP Biology because they felt it was NOT a benefit for a biology major.

I've heard that many of the science semester courses for example human anatomy, marine biology, etc is self instruct. The student received packets that they must complete within a time period. Little instruction goes on in the classroom. If you want more rigor and instruction than maybe the best choice is taking an AP class. Maybe that's why very few students take the AP test. Did the school offer an explanation to why only one student took the AP chemistry test?

PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

The school didn't tell me, a parent did. But when I quizzed the school today they did know that this year 5 kids took the test out of a class of 7.

No, I have no interest in my child using AP credit to get out of classes in college, at least not in her major or related areas. If she goes into, for instance, chemistry in college I'd only expect her to be able and willing to use AP US History and similar "liberal arts" type credits.

The purpose of takling APs, as I see it are:
1) Really challenge the student in the toughest classes available
2) Show prospective colleges that the child takes some of the toughest classes available and (hopefully!) succeeds
3) Gives colleges objective rankings from taking AP tests in contrast to letter grade in class which cannot be compared easily to other high schools
4) Maybe get college credit for liberal arts classes if they are not the child's ultimate career path

But, as usual: these are just my opinions and I may be wrong...
Peter Bealo

therents · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 141

Your thoughts are how I approached my kids taking AP classes.

For the most part I have been happy.

From what I hear the 2 students who did not take the AP chem class did not take it because the colleges they are attending will not give them credit for Chemistry. They require the students to take the course as freshman. My understanding is these 2 students are also in AP BIO and did not take the test for the same reason.

Did you happen to get the number of AP BIO students and the number who took the test?

PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

I did not. I was pretty dispirited/disgusted that anyone in the district would knowingly teach just a fraction of the required material that I've discounted that class to zero in my mind.

Peter Bealo

TRHSparent · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 147

It's hard to predict how any of the hs courses will be taught next year and/or in the near future. My students have reported more teachers are using self instruct methods in a variety of classes. In one course, the students become the teacher, present material, and students will be tested and graded on this presented material by these student teachers. The actual teachers will sit back, observe, and enter test results on PowerSchool.

If the students will be teaching themselves, why do we need professional development days and early release? Why are we paying teacher's salaries instead of babysitting and/or data entry salaries? Space should never become an issue at the hs because all a student needs is a desk and their work packet.

I'll find out soon enough if college lectures is just an old memory and the modern approach is completing work packets.

PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

May I ask which class(es) are known to use this self-teaching technique?? To me, it sounds like they're getting ready to go to a virtual school like VLACS. In a way that would be good: no more brick and mortar needed.

Peter Bealo

TRHSparent · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 147

Most science semester course i.e. human anatomy & physiologyand marine biology for example. World Studies and Geometry. I would need to talk to my students to list any other courses.

PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

I don't know about other world studies teachers (I believe there are at least 2...), but the Dube/Dutton duo do not use such techniques, at least not for the kids taking it for ACC credit.

They are however given a lot of homework. Not complaining mind you. Lots of writing is great for the kids.

Peter Bealo

therents · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 141

PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

I'm not close enough to say that there's a difference. My child though says there is and that class is split up on that basis pretty often.

I heard same about AP Bio. Also that AP Bio covers about 1/2 - 2/3 of the material required to do well on the test. So my child won't take this class until Sr year when doing poorly on AP test won't count on college admissions (assuming the schools she applies to care...).

Also heard that district is trying to get 2 teachers qualified for every AP science/math class instead of the 1 they have now.

Peter Bealo

therents · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 141

PBealo · Site Admin Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 309

Seems like no teacher cert, "just" class sylabus audits. From College Board website:

AP Course Audit Information

Submitting Materials for the AP Course Audit
To receive authorization from the College Board to label a course "AP," teachers without previous authorization for their course(s) must submit two documents related to the course: a syllabus and the subject-specific AP Course Audit form. Both documents are submitted online through the AP Course Audit Web site.
Course Syllabus
Each AP teacher is required to submit an electronic copy of his or her syllabus outlining the course of study to be followed for the academic year. Teachers' syllabi must provide clear and explicit evidence that the AP Course Audit requirements are included in their courses. Resources to help teachers create and evaluate their syllabi before submitting them are available on AP Central.
Curricular Resources for Teachers

AP Course Audit Form
The subject-specific AP Course Audit form specifies the curricular and resource requirements that must be met in order to receive authorization to use the "AP" designation for a course. These electronic forms are accessible only after registering and logging in to the AP Course Audit Web site, but the main content of the forms—the curricular and resource requirements—is available to the public on AP Central.
Curricular and Resource Requirements

Previously Authorized AP Courses
For information related to the annual renewal of previously authorized courses as well as account transfers for teachers who change schools and wish to associate their AP Course Audit account information with their new school, please visit the link below.
Overview and Timeline

Here are two points to keep in mind as you participate in the AP Course Audit:

As always, schools develop their own curricula for courses labeled "AP." The AP Course Audit simply specifies a set of expectations established by college and university faculty for college-level courses. Courses that meet or exceed these expectations will be authorized to use the "AP" designation.
The AP Course Audit is not a teacher certification process. There are no educational or professional background requirements to serve as an AP teacher. The College Board recognizes that there are many paths toward becoming an effective AP teacher, and the audit does not review anything about teachers beyond how they are demonstrating on their syllabi the inclusion of the course requirements or a viable alternative.
Note: If you are an online or distance learning course provider, or a brick-and-mortar school delivering your AP courses virtually, please visit the link below for information on how to request authorization to designate these courses "AP."
Online/Distance Learning AP Courses

AP Course Ledger
The AP Course Ledger is a comprehensive and public registry of all courses authorized to use the AP label on student transcripts. The Ledger is an annual and culminating product of the AP Course Audit, a process by which college faculty confirm that courses submitted by AP teachers and schools provide students with the essential elements of a college level experience. As an exclusively Web-based registry, the Ledger is published annually in November and updated weekly throughout the academic year to reflect newly authorized courses.

AP Authorized Courses

Back to Results

Timberlane Regional High School AP Course Title Total Authorized
AP Courses 2007-08 Total Authorized
AP Courses 2008-09
36 Greenough Road
Plaistow, NH 03865
US
http://www.timberlanehs.com AP Biology
AP Calculus AB
AP Chemistry
AP Computer Science A
AP English Literature and Composition
AP Physics B
AP Statistics
AP Studio Art: 2-D Design
AP Studio Art: 3-D Design
AP Studio Art: Drawing
AP U.S. Government and Politics
AP United States History
AP World History

therents · Joined: 29 Apr 2008 Posts: 141

KarenSteele · Joined: 11 Feb 2009 Posts: 14

So, I have to admit, it's a bit overwhelming reading all these different comments, positive and negative, about different teachers and different classes, along with what I hear from my own students. Other than the exchange of info, which is great, are there other actions being taken on classes/teachers that folks feel are not teaching our kids sufficiently?

Would there be any value in creating a list of classes/teachers and having folks fill in their comments? Perhaps something that could be brought to the SB/administration? Or armed with the list, if parents/students would request to NOT be in a certain class, the message might come across a little louder? Maybe something like shopping on Amazon, you can read people's reviews before "buying the product". If there's no demand for the product, it speaks volumes.

Perhaps I'm being too naive or idealistic here... but couldn't there be more rigor added?

It's not like in business, where the objectives are constantly changing -- teaching a class is supposed to cover a certain quantity, depth & breadth of material. And in most cases, this material hasn't changed much in the last several decades or even centuries, especially material that is taught at the high school level. For each class, is the desired content defined at the outset with a detailed syllabus? Are the objectives approved by the SB (or state or federal requirements) as an appropriate level of material to be taught? Is there evaluation at the end of classes to determine if the material was properly & completely taught? This review should come from students, parents as well as teachers & admin. If objectives aren't achieved there should be consequences.

As I've stated before, I wholeheartedly agree on this TV & Movies thing -- do these things need to be approved? By whom? I know that we had to sign a form saying that our student was allowed to watch Schindler's List.

I liked how Len broke down the days of school as well as minutes/days watching TV, and yet it was also scary.... has the adminstration done the same type of breakdown?

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